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 Question about holster legality....... 
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 Post subject: Question about holster legality.......
PostPosted: Sun Feb 15, 2009 8:54 am 
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First off, is a holster required to carry a pistol in Minnesota? The reason I ask is because I just purchased this "shoot-through" wallet holster for my LCP and am wondering if it's legal to use in Minnesota. IIRC, some states require that the trigger be covered to prevent accidental discharge. Here is said holster:

[img][img]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/0903/pianoman5355317/LCPWalletHolster002.jpg[/img][/img]

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 15, 2009 9:33 am 
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No holster is required in MN.

Any gun carried should have the trigger covered for safety. I don't like the "clips" attached to the gun to carry because they do not cover the trigger.

I would worry about the holster pictured dragging on the slide, interfering with the function of the gun.

How do you grip the gun? The grip is covered.

I see no purpose for the holster pictured except to maybe disguise the shape of the gun in a pocket.

Get a Mika or DeSantis pocket holster instead.


Last edited by westhope on Wed Feb 18, 2009 6:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 15, 2009 9:47 am 
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There is a finger hole below the trigger for your middle finger. Actually, I've shot the LCP with this holster attached and it's comfortable to shoot. The slide does not touch the leather in any way. The finger hole provides stability that's not there without the holster. These small .380's tend to "bounce" a little in your hand when firing with just a finger or 2 riding on the grip.

Until I bought this wallet holster, I've been using the holster below, but it's bulkier and heavier than the wallet holster.

[img][img]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/0903/pianoman5355317/BerettaLCPand40ammo007.jpg[/img][/img]

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 15, 2009 9:54 am 
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So, it appears this wallet holster is legal in Minnesota. What about other states? Is there any website where I can find out about holster legalities in other states? Thanks!

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 Post subject: Re: Question about holster legality.......
PostPosted: Sun Feb 15, 2009 9:57 am 
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Magnum Mikie wrote:
First off, is a holster required to carry a pistol in Minnesota? The reason I ask is because I just purchased this "shoot-through" wallet holster for my LCP and am wondering if it's legal to use in Minnesota. IIRC, some states require that the trigger be covered to prevent accidental discharge. Here is said holster:

[img][img]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/0903/pianoman5355317/LCPWalletHolster002.jpg[/img][/img]


That thing looks like an accident waiting to happen.


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PostPosted: Sun Feb 15, 2009 10:09 am 
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I know I've seen discussion on that very holster before. I don't think it's a MN law that makes it a problem, I think it's a Federal Law about making it into and AOW (any other weapon). It's the same law that covers pen guns. But, my feeble mind is not up to speed just yet.

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 15, 2009 10:20 am 
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DeanC wrote:
I know I've seen discussion on that very holster before. I don't think it's a MN law that makes it a problem, I think it's a Federal Law about making it into and AOW (any other weapon). It's the same law that covers pen guns. But, my feeble mind is not up to speed just yet.



Dean, if what you say is true, then the fed law over-rides state laws and makes it illegal to use in our state, right?

Oh well, at least I have my other traditional pocket holster to use :?

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 15, 2009 11:09 am 
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I'm certainly no expert, but I know enough to recognize a bad idea when I see one. 90 % of the reason for a holster is ignored by this devise. I'm gonna go out on a limb and call it, not just a gimmick, a dangerous gimmick.

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 15, 2009 11:20 am 
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bensdad wrote:
I'm gonna go out on a limb and call it, not just a gimmick, a dangerous gimmick.


This design is not a new design. A friend has a similar holster that he bought many years ago for his Colt 1908 pocket pistol.

I can understand using the word "gimmick", but please go out on a limb some more by explaining how it is dangerous.

I know of a few guys that carry pocket pistols in their pocket without any holster and some gals carry in their purses without holsters. I guess, with the very long trigger pull of a LCP, I don't see how this holster is any more dangerous than carrying without a holster.

That being said, I still have my other traditional pocket holster that works good enough.

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 15, 2009 12:15 pm 
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A moment of stress, you quickly put/jam hand into pocket and inadvertently cover/pull/press trigger and the gun goes off. Dextarity goes WAY down under stress conditions.. You have the gun in your back pocket (or front) and lean up against something with enough protrussion to work the trigger, AD. Someone grabs you ass, (wanted or unwanted) happens to get finger into trigger cut out.. Bang AD. Blow these off if you want, but ALL possible. 15.00 dollars will get you a DeSantis Nemisus (SP?), covers better, protects better, safer.
These guys aren't blowing smoke up your tail pipe. (at least on this one :) )

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 15, 2009 12:47 pm 
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http://fullautofun.homestead.com/page36.html
Quote:
The case is U.S. v. Davis, Crim No. 8:93-106 (S.C. 1993) (Report of Magistrate, June 21, 1993). By the same token in mid 1996, ATF decided that "wallet" holsters for small guns, from which the gun could be fired, somehow are AOW's. This would affect, for example, the North American Arms mini-revolver and the wallet holster NAA sold for the gun, as an accessory. ATF seems to be thinking that the grip has disappeared, and thus it fits into the first category. This strikes me as bizarre and stupid, and I suspect the courts will have their shot at it, given how common the wallet holsters are. What if you put the gun in a purse, from which it can be fired? A folded up newspaper? How are those different than a wallet holster?


Sounds like this guy may have the right info:
http://www.artofthehide.com/History-ATF ... ation.html


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PostPosted: Sun Feb 15, 2009 1:40 pm 
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Thanks Pakrat, that's what I was thinking of. Couldn't remember if that was resolved or not. I knew there was some hang up about it.

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 15, 2009 2:35 pm 
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I just received the following comment from a knowledgeable holster manufacturer:
It is our understanding that the FTB-BATF classified this design as
non-any other weapon (or not a wallet holster) primarily because it is "readily discernible as a weapon" due to the exposed slide. The old designed wallet holsters covered the slide. As long as it isn't modified to conceal the weapon over the slide it is legal to own and use in conjunction with a semi-automatic pistol without falling in the AOW classification.

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 15, 2009 2:52 pm 
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CraigJS wrote:
A moment of stress, you quickly put/jam hand into pocket and inadvertently cover/pull/press trigger and the gun goes off. Dextarity goes WAY down under stress conditions.. You have the gun in your back pocket (or front) and lean up against something with enough protrussion to work the trigger, AD. Someone grabs you ass, (wanted or unwanted) happens to get finger into trigger cut out.. Bang AD. Blow these off if you want, but ALL possible. 15.00 dollars will get you a DeSantis Nemisus (SP?), covers better, protects better, safer.
These guys aren't blowing smoke up your tail pipe. (at least on this one :) )


... Your hands are full, you're busy looking at cute girls, etc., etc., and your keys end up in the same pocket as the gun. One key gets in trigger well. When you try to retrieve your keys, you get shot in the testes. What else does a guy put in his pockets that could get in there? Pocket-knife, small light?

The trigger of a holstered gun should be inaccessible. Otherwise it's not in a holster, it's in a... I don't know what the hell it's in.

Quote:
I know of a few guys that carry pocket pistols in their pocket without any holster and some gals carry in their purses without holsters.


I know some people who:
don't have a fire extinguisher in the house
don't wear their seatbelts
smoke and drink too much

You could carry an LCP in that rig for the next 39 years and never have a bad thing happen. You could also blow a .38 in. hole into your femoral artery on Monday afternoon and spend the last 23 seconds of your life resenting Bensdad. I know everything in life involves risk, I just prefer to minimize it in the obvious places. I generally wear my seatbelt. I have fire extinguishers. I don't drink (but I smoke and chew too much). I want my triggers covered when not in use.

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 15, 2009 3:13 pm 
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bensdad wrote:
CraigJS wrote:
A moment of stress, you quickly put/jam hand into pocket and inadvertently cover/pull/press trigger and the gun goes off. Dextarity goes WAY down under stress conditions.. You have the gun in your back pocket (or front) and lean up against something with enough protrussion to work the trigger, AD. Someone grabs you ass, (wanted or unwanted) happens to get finger into trigger cut out.. Bang AD. Blow these off if you want, but ALL possible. 15.00 dollars will get you a DeSantis Nemisus (SP?), covers better, protects better, safer.
These guys aren't blowing smoke up your tail pipe. (at least on this one :) )


... Your hands are full, you're busy looking at cute girls, etc., etc., and your keys end up in the same pocket as the gun. One key gets in trigger well. When you try to retrieve your keys, you get shot in the testes. What else does a guy put in his pockets that could get in there? Pocket-knife, small light?

The trigger of a holstered gun should be inaccessible. Otherwise it's not in a holster, it's in a... I don't know what the hell it's in.

Quote:
I know of a few guys that carry pocket pistols in their pocket without any holster and some gals carry in their purses without holsters.


I know some people who:
don't have a fire extinguisher in the house
don't wear their seatbelts
smoke and drink too much

You could carry an LCP in that rig for the next 39 years and never have a bad thing happen. You could also blow a .38 in. hole into your femoral artery on Monday afternoon and spend the last 23 seconds of your life resenting Bensdad. I know everything in life involves risk, I just prefer to minimize it in the obvious places. I generally wear my seatbelt. I have fire extinguishers. I don't drink (but I smoke and chew too much). I want my triggers covered when not in use.


++1

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