Twin Cities Carry Forum Archive :: View topic - CSM: Vote NO on nationalizing the worst concealed carry laws

Andrew Rothman wrote:

Enforcing the Full Faith and Credit clause is not an imposition against states' rights.

Incakola wrote:

Andrew Rothman wrote:

Enforcing the Full Faith and Credit clause is not an imposition against states' rights.

But is can also be superseded by individual state laws.

Quote:

This Constitution, and the laws of the United States which shall be made in pursuance thereof; and all treaties made, or which shall be made, under the authority of the United States, shall be the supreme law of the land; and the judges in every state shall be bound thereby, anything in the Constitution or laws of any State to the contrary notwithstanding.

Quote:

Article IV

Section 1. Full faith and credit shall be given in each state to the public acts, records, and judicial proceedings of every other state. And the Congress may by general laws prescribe the manner in which such acts, records, and proceedings shall be proved, and the effect thereof.

Quote:

Incakola wrote:

Quote:

this means Federal law trumps state... State does not trump state...

FFandC is completely up for interpretation at this point. (See the Gay-Marriage fiasco with it.)

Incakola wrote:

While this bill may be beneficial to us, I am not in favor of it simply because it is imposing federal regulation on a state issue...

Beneficial to RKBA, but harmful to state liberties.

I'm weary of Federal imposing any regulation on what should be handled at a state level, especially when the RKBA comes into play.

Lenny7 wrote:

Incakola wrote:

You're absolutely right, of course. The correct remedy would be to remove the states ability to restrict our 2A rights altogether. We don't allow states to restrict our 1A rights, after all.

Author:	chunkstyle [ Tue Jul 14, 2009 4:16 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: CSM: Vote NO on nationalizing the worst concealed carry laws
She's right, on one level, of course. We shouldn't nationalize the worst concealed carry laws, like those of New Jersey. We should nationalize the best ones, like those of Vermont.

Author:	Andrew Rothman [ Wed Jul 15, 2009 10:30 am ]
Post subject:	Re: CSM: Vote NO on nationalizing the worst concealed carry laws
Enforcing the Full Faith and Credit clause is not an imposition against states' rights.

Author:	RobD [ Wed Jul 15, 2009 12:39 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: CSM: Vote NO on nationalizing the worst concealed carry laws
Andrew Rothman wrote: Enforcing the Full Faith and Credit clause is not an imposition against states' rights. But is can also be superseded by individual state laws.

Author:	Jeremiah [ Thu Jul 16, 2009 6:55 am ]
Post subject:	Re: CSM: Vote NO on nationalizing the worst concealed carry laws
Incakola wrote: Andrew Rothman wrote: Enforcing the Full Faith and Credit clause is not an imposition against states' rights. But is can also be superseded by individual state laws. Well, no. The Constitution in pretty clear in saying that it trumps state laws. From Article VI: Quote: This Constitution, and the laws of the United States which shall be made in pursuance thereof; and all treaties made, or which shall be made, under the authority of the United States, shall be the supreme law of the land; and the judges in every state shall be bound thereby, anything in the Constitution or laws of any State to the contrary notwithstanding. Article IV, Sec. 1 gives the acts of each state equal validity in all of them, AND gives Congress the power to prescribe how. Quote: Article IV Section 1. Full faith and credit shall be given in each state to the public acts, records, and judicial proceedings of every other state. And the Congress may by general laws prescribe the manner in which such acts, records, and proceedings shall be proved, and the effect thereof.

Author:	RobD [ Thu Jul 16, 2009 9:09 am ]
Post subject:	Re: CSM: Vote NO on nationalizing the worst concealed carry laws
Quote: This Constitution, and the laws of the United States which shall be made in pursuance thereof; and all treaties made, or which shall be made, under the authority of the United States, shall be the supreme law of the land; and the judges in every state shall be bound thereby, anything in the Constitution or laws of any State to the contrary notwithstanding. this means Federal law trumps state... State does not trump state... FFandC is completely up for interpretation at this point. (See the Gay-Marriage fiasco with it.)

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Author:	Jeremiah [ Mon Jul 20, 2009 7:16 am ]
Post subject:	Re: CSM: Vote NO on nationalizing the worst concealed carry laws
Incakola wrote: Quote: This Constitution, and the laws of the United States which shall be made in pursuance thereof; and all treaties made, or which shall be made, under the authority of the United States, shall be the supreme law of the land; and the judges in every state shall be bound thereby, anything in the Constitution or laws of any State to the contrary notwithstanding. this means Federal law trumps state... State does not trump state... FFandC is completely up for interpretation at this point. (See the Gay-Marriage fiasco with it.) True, as far as it goes- but Federal law (in this case, a power directly granted by the Constitution) directly requiring one state to recognize another's acts trumps an individual state's objections- i.e., assuming carry were given the "FF&C treatment", Illinois and Wisconsin would pretty much have to put up with it, regardless of their legislatures' unhappiness.

Author:	ComradeBurg [ Tue Jul 21, 2009 7:27 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: CSM: Vote NO on nationalizing the worst concealed carry laws
I'm very glad that this message was posted. I was having a bloody difficult time finding the phone number for Al Fraken. As per requested I did call both of my senators, although I told them to vote for the reciprocity instead of against. Oh well it's the thought that counts right.

Author:	gyrfalcon [ Mon Jul 27, 2009 5:42 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: CSM: Vote NO on nationalizing the worst concealed carry laws
Incakola wrote: While this bill may be beneficial to us, I am not in favor of it simply because it is imposing federal regulation on a state issue... Beneficial to RKBA, but harmful to state liberties. I'm weary of Federal imposing any regulation on what should be handled at a state level, especially when the RKBA comes into play. Unfortunately State liberties and powers have been severely butchered over the decades. The RKBA is a fundamental part of the Constitution. I would much rather have it imposed federally like countless other regulations than banned or limited by States that dislike it.

Author:	djeepp [ Wed Aug 12, 2009 8:40 am ]
Post subject:	Re: CSM: Vote NO on nationalizing the worst concealed carry laws
Lenny7 wrote: Incakola wrote: While this bill may be beneficial to us, I am not in favor of it simply because it is imposing federal regulation on a state issue... Beneficial to RKBA, but harmful to state liberties. I'm weary of Federal imposing any regulation on what should be handled at a state level, especially when the RKBA comes into play. You're absolutely right, of course. The correct remedy would be to remove the states ability to restrict our 2A rights altogether. We don't allow states to restrict our 1A rights, after all. What? The right to free speech, freedom to practice religion, right to refuse quarter of a soldier in peace time, right to be secure in our persons, papers and effects, the right to not be a witness against ourself, the right to confront our witness, the right to a jury trial, the right to reasonable punishment are not defined by our state legislatures? We need to tell someone that we've been had!

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