Index  •  FAQ  •  Search  

It is currently Thu Mar 28, 2024 3:27 am

This is a static archive the Twin Cities Carry forum, maintained as a public service by the current forum of record, The Minnesota Carry Forum.

All times are UTC - 6 hours




Forum locked This topic is locked, you cannot edit posts or make further replies.  [ 47 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3, 4  Next
 URGENT, urgent -- CCW vote on Monday in Senate 
Author Message
 Post subject: URGENT, urgent -- CCW vote on Monday in Senate
PostPosted: Sat Jul 18, 2009 5:04 pm 
Wise Elder
User avatar

Joined: Thu Aug 11, 2005 7:48 pm
Posts: 2782
Location: St. Paul
Subject: GOA ALERT: Nat'l. Carry Vote Monday!!; More On NRA Against Sotomayor
Date: Sat, 18 Jul 2009 08:08:59 -0700


Vote on Right to Carry Coming Soon
-- Please urge your Senators to vote YES!

Gun Owners of America E-Mail Alert
8001 Forbes Place, Suite 102, Springfield, VA 22151
Phone: 703-321-8585 / FAX: 703-321-8408
http://www.gunowners.org


Friday, July 17, 2009

A vote to protect your right to travel out-of-state with a firearm could
come to a vote next week -- even as early as Monday!

Senators John Thune and David Vitter are the sponsors of S. 845 -- a
bill that will establish concealed carry reciprocity amongst the several
states.

Senators Thune and Vitter offered the bill as an amendment (#1618) to
the Department of Defense authorization bill (H.R. 2647).


This provision will use the constitutional authority allowing Congress
to enforce "full faith and credit" across the country, so that each
state respects the "public acts, records, and judicial proceedings" of
every other state (Article IV).

The benefit of the Thune/Vitter legislation is that -- unlike other,
competing measures -- it would protect the right of any U.S. citizen to
carry out of state (regardless of whether he possesses a permit), as
long as he is authorized to carry in his home state. This is important
because of states like Vermont and Alaska, where residents can carry
concealed without prior approval or permission from the state... in
other words, without a permit!

ACTION: Please urge your Senators to vote YES on the Thune/Vitter
concealed carry reciprocity amendment that will be offered to the
Department of Defense authorization bill and NO on any modifying
amendments. This vote could come as early as Monday, so please act on
this right away!

You can use the Gun Owners Legislative Action Center at
http://www.gunowners.org/activism.htm to send your Senators the
pre-written e-mail message below.


----- Pre-written letter -----

Dear Senator:

Please support the Thune/Vitter amendment to the Department of Defense
authorization bill. This amendment will protect the right of citizens to
carry firearms outside of their home state without violating the rights
of the other states. Thus, the reciprocity language masterfully protects
the principle of federalism while also promoting Second Amendment
rights.

A person's right to defend himself and his family should not end at the
border of his state.

I urge you to vote for the Thune/Vitter concealed carry amendment (no. 1618) and to
oppose any modifying actions that seek to alter or weaken their amendment.

Sincerely,

YOUR NAME

_________________
President of AACFI, GOCRA, CCRN, and A2A


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: URGENT, urgent -- CCW vote on Monday in Senate
PostPosted: Sat Jul 18, 2009 5:06 pm 
Wise Elder
User avatar

Joined: Thu Aug 11, 2005 7:48 pm
Posts: 2782
Location: St. Paul
This is a good test for SENATOR Al Franken.

Is he anti-gun or not. If he votes "no," he is the ENEMY.

_________________
President of AACFI, GOCRA, CCRN, and A2A


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: URGENT, urgent -- CCW vote on Monday in Senate
PostPosted: Sat Jul 18, 2009 7:04 pm 
The Man
User avatar

Joined: Sun Aug 07, 2005 5:43 am
Posts: 7970
Location: Minneapolis MN
kimberman wrote:
This is a good test for SENATOR Al Franken.

Is he anti-gun or not. If he votes "no," he is the ENEMY.
I think it's not going to be a shock to anybody how he votes, but I'd love it if I'm wrong.

_________________
Just a guy.


Offline
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: URGENT, urgent -- CCW vote on Monday in Senate
PostPosted: Sun Jul 19, 2009 8:13 pm 
Journeyman Member
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jul 27, 2008 2:36 pm
Posts: 67
Location: Apple Valley, MN
Given Franken's previous statements on gun control, I would be amazed if he voted in favor of this amendment.


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: URGENT, urgent -- CCW vote on Monday in Senate
PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 9:13 am 
Longtime Regular
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jan 15, 2008 9:40 pm
Posts: 2264
Location: Eden Prairie
I'm torn here, guys. Somebody help me out (seriously).

From a 2A perspective, I want my senators voting yes. But the conservative in me wants them voting no, because I strongly believe in states' rights, which this would seem to erode.

-Mark


Offline
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: URGENT, urgent -- CCW vote on Monday in Senate
PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 9:26 am 
Longtime Regular

Joined: Fri Mar 17, 2006 4:00 pm
Posts: 1064
Location: Minneapolis, MN
Protect the 2A and Constitution first, then work on states rights.


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: URGENT, urgent -- CCW vote on Monday in Senate
PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 9:28 am 
Member

Joined: Wed Jul 08, 2009 7:37 am
Posts: 25
I guess the way I look at the amendment is that we want it handled as a 2nd amendment issue so that the states can't regulate away our right to keep and bear arms under their 10th amendment rights.


Offline
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: URGENT, urgent -- CCW vote on Monday in Senate
PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 5:07 pm 
Senior Member
User avatar

Joined: Thu Jan 19, 2006 7:51 pm
Posts: 372
Location: Lakeville
This topic is kinda interesting to me.. I know some gun guys have been watching the gay marriage stuff, i.e. requiring a state to recognize it based on full faith and credit (recognize one marriage from one state, have to recognize all marriages from the state) and hoping it would apply to CCW permits, and I also know of gay groups watching this, thinking it could set a precedence for gay marriage certificate.

If this passes, it would help me immediately with my CCW permit, but it could help lay groundwork if I do get hitched in the future :)

I also know this probably made afew people jump back a bit, so I hope this doesn't get too uncivilized too quickly..

_________________
Certified MN Carry Permit instructor
check http://www.mncarrytraining.com/ for info

My Homebrew journal http://brew.goalie.cx


Offline
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: URGENT, urgent -- CCW vote on Monday in Senate
PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 8:04 pm 
Journeyman Member
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jul 27, 2008 2:36 pm
Posts: 67
Location: Apple Valley, MN
This doesn't have anything to do with state's rights. States don't have the right to infringe your rights, and with the "full faith and credit" clause of the Constitution applied correctly, states will have to accept CCW permits and marriage permits. We would not be discussing state's rights if it came to regulation of speech, so why arms or sexual preferences?

These kinds of issues confuse me, because to support one and deny the other (regardless of which side you are on) seems a bit hypocritical in my opinion. In either case: people have a right to do as they wish, be it carrying a gun or marrying a person of the same sex. You don't have to like or support it, but the government doesn't have the right to say what you do with your life.

I'm not gay- I personally find the practice of homosexuality to be against God's design, but since this is a free society, I am not going to force my views on others through legislation. I could say the same thing about gay rights activists who support gun control. There are limits to this, of course, but as long as you aren't directly harming someone else, I say people should be able to do whatever they want. This is liberalism in its real sense, not the statist attitude that I've witnessed from people who cry foul when the liberties they support are being squashed, but will rally to squash someone else's freedom because they don't agree with it the next day.


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: URGENT, urgent -- CCW vote on Monday in Senate
PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 8:29 pm 
Longtime Regular
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jan 15, 2008 9:40 pm
Posts: 2264
Location: Eden Prairie
You know what, I can live with those answers (all the responses), and as I think more about it, yup, this falls exactly into my viewpoint.

Less government regulation is good, and I think this leads to that overall.

-Mark


Offline
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: URGENT, urgent -- CCW vote on Monday in Senate
PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 9:04 pm 
Senior Member
User avatar

Joined: Thu Jan 19, 2006 7:51 pm
Posts: 372
Location: Lakeville
singhcr wrote:
TThese kinds of issues confuse me, because to support one and deny the other (regardless of which side you are on) seems a bit hypocritical in my opinion. In either case: people have a right to do as they wish, be it carrying a gun or marrying a person of the same sex. You don't have to like or support it, but the government doesn't have the right to say what you do with your life.

That is one problem I find with so many issues. Both sides are so gung ho against restricting the other sides rights that they don't see it as a way that can help both people win more rights/freedoms/benefits.

_________________
Certified MN Carry Permit instructor
check http://www.mncarrytraining.com/ for info

My Homebrew journal http://brew.goalie.cx


Offline
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: URGENT, urgent -- CCW vote on Monday in Senate
PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 9:25 pm 
Longtime Regular
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jan 15, 2008 9:40 pm
Posts: 2264
Location: Eden Prairie
gaygoalie wrote:
singhcr wrote:
TThese kinds of issues confuse me, because to support one and deny the other (regardless of which side you are on) seems a bit hypocritical in my opinion. In either case: people have a right to do as they wish, be it carrying a gun or marrying a person of the same sex. You don't have to like or support it, but the government doesn't have the right to say what you do with your life.

That is one problem I find with so many issues. Both sides are so gung ho against restricting the other sides rights that they don't see it as a way that can help both people win more rights/freedoms/benefits.


+1000, to both the quote and your response


Offline
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: URGENT, urgent -- CCW vote on Monday in Senate
PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 9:59 pm 
Longtime Regular

Joined: Sat May 17, 2008 9:55 pm
Posts: 598
Location: Dundas, Minnesota
I keep saying this is the last time I'll jump in on the topic (this bill). Eventually I'll mean it. Passage of this bill will be followed by "noise" in the news about how some states have little or no training needed for a permit. This will be followed by clamouring for some "common sense" structure to the permitting process (to make things safer and consistent).

I'll meet you all back here in 5 years, when the permit to carry is issued federally. It will involve fingerprinting, a class with a standardized curriculum and course of fire, reference letters, significantly larger fee, no 30-day requirement (they'll issue your permit when they damn well please), open-carry will be banned outright, you'll only be able to carry the gun(s) listed on your permit, no church carry, no carry near booze, etc., etc., etc. This will also involve a massive new branch of the BATFE.

God, I hope I'm wrong. I've been called a nervous-pervous before. Then again, I've been right before (twice).

Simply put, this is the Fed. telling the states what they can/can't do. Color it however you like. Put a dress on it. It's still a pig. Anyone play chess? Recognize the gambit?

_________________
I say I'm cleaning guns... My wife says I'm petting them.


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: URGENT, urgent -- CCW vote on Monday in Senate
PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 10:18 pm 
Senior Member
User avatar

Joined: Thu Jan 19, 2006 7:51 pm
Posts: 372
Location: Lakeville
bensdad wrote:
I keep saying this is the last time I'll jump in on the topic (this bill). Eventually I'll mean it. Passage of this bill will be followed by "noise" in the news about how some states have little or no training needed for a permit. This will be followed by clamouring for some "common sense" structure to the permitting process (to make things safer and consistent).

does anyone bring this up with drivers licenses? States aren't identical on that.. Same with marriage licenses.. some have a waiting period.. others require blood work..

If they really push for the "they aren't the same in every state" theres alot of push back that could be used on existing licenses that are recognized as being the same in multiple states.

_________________
Certified MN Carry Permit instructor
check http://www.mncarrytraining.com/ for info

My Homebrew journal http://brew.goalie.cx


Offline
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: URGENT, urgent -- CCW vote on Monday in Senate
PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 10:38 pm 
Longtime Regular

Joined: Sat May 17, 2008 9:55 pm
Posts: 598
Location: Dundas, Minnesota
gaygoalie wrote:
bensdad wrote:
I keep saying this is the last time I'll jump in on the topic (this bill). Eventually I'll mean it. Passage of this bill will be followed by "noise" in the news about how some states have little or no training needed for a permit. This will be followed by clamouring for some "common sense" structure to the permitting process (to make things safer and consistent).

does anyone bring this up with drivers licenses? States aren't identical on that.. Same with marriage licenses.. some have a waiting period.. others require blood work..

If they really push for the "they aren't the same in every state" theres alot of push back that could be used on existing licenses that are recognized as being the same in multiple states.


Yeah, cuz there's a huge "anti-driver's license" crowd trying to find a way to divide and conquer drivers. And that anti-marriage license movement has a huge following in the senate. Your examples are completely dissimilar to P to C. Look, I believe a huge segment of the 2A crowd is looking at this as a good thing (rose-colored glasses). I believe that by supporting this, we shoot ourselves in the foot (figuratively). Hey, stick this thread in your memory bank. Point it out in 5 years and say, "Look what an idiot Bensdad was! He thought the sky was falling!" I'll be the first to admit I was wrong. If, on the other hand, I'm right...

I'm right. This is a Trojan horse. Supporting it is foolishness. Moths to the flame.

_________________
I say I'm cleaning guns... My wife says I'm petting them.


Offline
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Forum locked This topic is locked, you cannot edit posts or make further replies.  [ 47 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3, 4  Next

This is a static archive the Twin Cities Carry forum, maintained as a public service by the current forum of record, The Minnesota Carry Forum.

All times are UTC - 6 hours


 Who is online 

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 22 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
cron


 
Index  |  FAQ  |  Search

phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group