Hi all,

The other weekend I took out my brother-n-law to the range as he had recently purchased a Barretta 92 (or some other form of Barretta). I was talking about the need to keep your grip firm and elbows locked to prevent a "stovepipe" (spent caseing jammed with the primer down and the open end up stuck between the slide and the bolt for the unfamilar) I showed him how NOT to hold the gun and fired some rounds so I could demo how to clear a stovepipe if one happened. To my disbelief, I could not get my Sig 229 to malfunction! Now eather Sigs are BETTER then I knew Ok, so I couldn't get his Barretta to stove pipe either. I took the limpest grip I could without dropping the gun and actually pulled back on the gun to aid in a jam, but they both just kept chambering rounds.

Have others noticed this is not much of a problem on other guns or is it only certain "special" guns like Sigs that don't seem to have the problem?

Mostly-

Was the Berretta dirty? Limp wristing with a unlubed slide could have been the problem. Or it was a bad round...

Try Blazer or Wolf ammunition if you want to stove pipe. Seems to stove pipe more often than say winchester.

Pakrat - I was trying to get either gun to stove pipe but couldn't make them. The intent was to show what happens if you limp wrist or don't lock your elbows, and then to demo how to clear a jam of this specific type.

Both of us were using Wolf ammo - it don't get much cheaper then that.

After cleaning my gun after my last encounter with Wolf the stuff runs though my Sig pretty well - at least as well as the Winchester White box.

Go figure - want a jam - it ain't gonna happen: don't want a jam then nothing in the world will save you.

Mostly-

Ok, I misunderstood. I thought it had stovepiped for him. Then of course you couldn't recreate it.

Nevermind. Stop lubing a gun and you'll probably see more stovepipes... if that helps... ha

Murphy's Laws pretty much guarantee that stovepipes, like cops, are never available when you want them.

Say, Mostlylawabidingcitizen, I had a similar experience. I had purchased a Para Warthog and had some FTF and FTE. I sent it into Para, where they did some work on it. I also purchased and installed some Wolf springs in the magazines.

I went to the range to run some more ammo through it. After about 200 rounds, I thought I would try to get to jam. I did everything; I could think of to get to malfunction. I held it as limply as I could. Fired with my elbow bent in ever which angle. The gun never burped! I must have ran another 200 rounds through it in complete amazement.

Ya just never know…

Did you try the gangsta-style?

Good full power ammunition is a way to avoid problems - if you want to create a problem - like a type 2 (Failure to EJECT) you may just have to manually create the dilemna.

Clearance is Brass high - move + a tap rack/flip

Try a type 3 - Failure to eject. Brass Low (one in the chamber - one on the way into the chamber. The mother of all malfunctions - Look - brass low - move - lock slide - strip mag / rackx3 - insert fresh mag - rack point in and place 2 center mass hits to target.

OR

Throw gun on ground - swear profusely - surrender (naw) - or draw another gun.......

I've put thousands of rounds through my Sigs and have yet to get a stovepipe out of them. However, that doesn't mean it could never happen.

The main reason you didn't see the stovepipe, is that the 9mm is a high pressure cartridge and has significantly higher recoil impulse. If you limp wrist a .45 it will typically stovepipe on you, but you would have to change your recoil spring on a 9mm for a stronger one, to the point where it will barely function normally before a limpwristed grip will make it hangup.

The Warthog is a 45 cal. with a 3” barrel. I did not have any jams, of any kind, (See post above).

No, I did not try: “gangsta-style?”

However, I did have a Kimber Ultra Ten II, that did it all, including stove pipe jams. It had a FTF, FTE or stovepipes documented about every three rounds. I had others at the range fire it, with the same results.

It went back to the Kimber Custom Shop twice, before the Head of the Custom Shop said (after insisting on several occasions that I was “limp wristing” it) “The 1911 was never designed to have a double stack”. :?

He finally gave me full credit for a trade on a different model.

FWIW I own several 45cal. autoloaders. All have short barrels and I've never had a stovepipe jam with any of them, until that Kimber.

Dang! the Kimber Ultra Ten was going to be my first try at a 45... Thanks for the info.

Inregards to Selurcspi comment about 9mm - that is great... Except my sig is in 40cal....

Mostly-

[quote="mostlylawabidingcitizen] Dang! the Kimber Ultra Ten was going to be my first try at a 45... Thanks for the info.

Inregards to Selurcspi comment about 9mm - that is great... Except my sig is in 40cal....

Mostly-[/quote]

Mostly,

I didn't say you couldn't make a 45 not stovepipe, I carry one myself, but if you bet your life on it, you should have a good smith set the gun up for the type of ammo you intend to use. A good setup for your defensive ammo will typically cover most available commercial offerings, the caveat is you should always make a significant test when you make a change, I would suggest several hundred rounds without a malfunction.

As for the SIG, if my memory serves me correctly (I work for an anti gun company and can’t check) I believe the 40 is also a high pressure cartridge and has a similar recoil impulse to the 9mm.

Mostly,

I didn't say you couldn't make a 45 not stovepipe, I carry one myself, but if you bet your life on it, you should have a good smith set the gun up for... [/quote]

Sorry, I was mearly stating that I REALLY like the Kimber 10 and but I'm not prepared to put up with all the issues you have encountered with yours, hence I'll most likely be reevaluating my "enamerment" with the Ultra 10.

Mostly-