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 Least favorite gun store? 
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 Post subject: Re: Did you tell the whole truth?
PostPosted: Sat Nov 12, 2005 10:39 pm 
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goalie wrote:
HartBrothers wrote:
Moby Clarke wrote:
I guess I need to check the web site for Hart Brothers, but based on the prices I see at the MN Weapons Collector shows they attend, I would not be able to afford anything from them. I recall last fall the show at the RiverCenter that they had a 2nd gen Glock 19 for $550 with 1 10 round mag. I asked if they were flexible and the gentleman I spoke with indicated that the price was already so low I was a moron for asking if he could go lower. I quickly left the table.


Did you forget to mention that this Glock had an internal laser? Small details like this do adjust the price of the firearm. I have worked with Milan for 33 years (his wife) and I do not believe he called you or anyone else a moron. He is patient to a fault, and never uses the term moron even when he is upset. You did not ask if he was flexible you asked if there was any further Police Discount. But again, the big price difference is because of the $350 internal guide rod laser. We still have the firearm for inspection.


Aaah, another great example of how what is NOT said is often more important than what is said.



My experience with Hart's occurred in the spring of 2004. The gun I looked at did not have any modifications to it. I never stated I was actually called any name, but, that I was made to feel like an idiot for even asking if the price was firm. I understand some of you have had a good experience with them, and maybe I will give them another look. However, that does not excuse the condescending attitude I experienced.
As a final note, their site does not work. YMMV.

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 15, 2005 1:50 am 
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First regarding the Outdoorsman in Hopkins. For years this was a second home to me, really friendly people, good prices, VERY knowlegable people and they split the store with ammocraft, so you got to see those guys too. After a variety of owners, who all tried to inpose their ideas of what a gun shop should be, the final owners came here from a Federal job in Alaska. He personally blamed all republicans for the Exxon Valdez incident, and felt that he new much more than all his customers combined.
His comment on price haggling rings a bell with me, I walked in one day and found a bubba'd up model 99 Savage in 300 savage on the shelf. I asked to see it and was told it was a collectors item, (it was not) and it was posted on the "Internet!!!" It was a post war model EG with two sets of mount holes, a non professionally done butt pad and off line butt stud for sling swivels. it was priced at $575 It was a $250 gun tops. I kept my mouth shut and handed the gun back to the owner and said "ok, thanks." He asked if I was going to buy it? "ahhh no, thank you" I was fully polite and just said it has had too much done to it. He then demanded to know why it was I wanted to see it. He was getting mad and asked "What would i do if all people did all day was come to my shop and want to look at stuff but never buy?" I said. "gee if everybody did that, I would think about what it was I was doing wrong." He told me to leave the store. I told him I had bought at least 30 guns from the store over the years, that I trusted Grump (the smithy) to work on all my guns, but that until he wanted customers, he was never going to make it.
His wife was pleasant but dim, they treated grump like a unwanted nuisance despite he was at times 50% of the business. They did have a nice dog.

I really like AL at AL's gun shop in WBL. nice guy knows his business and veryvery willing to order in what ever you want. Al knows i like 99 savages and I know he likes old colts, so i keep my eyes open and so does he.

I also like Gunstop, Howard and John really know the business and john in particular is maybe the single most informed guy on reloading in the metro area. Howard may be gruff, but is a nice guy and is willing to stand behind stuff, I bought a used model 100 in 284 win from him and took it out and would not extract. looked closer and discovered the extractor had a big chip out of it so it was only getting about a 20% bite on the rim and it was slipping over. He called Ahlmans and ordered the part for me for free after first asking me if I wanted to return the gun. I said no, shot nice, just find me a extractor, I installed the new part myself a couple days later.

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 15, 2005 8:56 am 
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1911fan wrote:
First regarding the Outdoorsman in Hopkins. For years this was a second home to me, really friendly people, good prices, VERY knowlegable people and they split the store with ammocraft, so you got to see those guys too. After a variety of owners, who all tried to inpose their ideas of what a gun shop should be, the final owners came here from a Federal job in Alaska. He personally blamed all republicans for the Exxon Valdez incident, and felt that he new much more than all his customers combined.


(Some stuff snipped simply to save bytes)

I went there early this summer/late spring when business took me to that area and they were having a "clearance sale" (has the place closed for good?). I didn't buy anything and didn't get a great vibe. There wasn't anything for sale in there that interested me, I think they were down to a few CZs and some long guns.

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I also like Gunstop, Howard and John really know the business and john in particular is maybe the single most informed guy on reloading in the metro area. Howard may be gruff, but is a nice guy and is willing to stand behind stuff, I bought a used model 100 in 284 win from him and took it out and would not extract. looked closer and discovered the extractor had a big chip out of it so it was only getting about a 20% bite on the rim and it was slipping over. He called Ahlmans and ordered the part for me for free after first asking me if I wanted to return the gun. I said no, shot nice, just find me a extractor, I installed the new part myself a couple days later.


Gunstop is great, and when it comes to reloading John Walton is THE MAN. I buy almost all my reloading supplies there with the exception of nickel 10mm cases, which he doesn't seem to carry. For a small operation, his prices are really competitive, I don't think you can order jacketed bullets any cheaper from Midway.

As a 'fer instance', I decided I had to save .01 and shoot some Rainier plated .45s, leaning on the net.wisdom that everyone seemed to have good luck with him. John warned me I ought not bother with them, and sure enough he was right, as he was on Power Pistol vs. Blue Dot and every other ill-informed decision I had. Getting started reloading would have been a lot harder without his wisdom.

I think the gun side of the business does a great job in carrying quality guns, too. You don't look in the case and see a lot of junk, new or used. I can't comment on their expertise in advice, since I've always gone in there knowing what I wanted ahead of time, but I don't doubt they know a hell of a lot.


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 15, 2005 9:25 am 
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mobocracy wrote:
I think they were down to a few CZs and some long guns.

A few CZ's were all the handguns they carried.

They are gone, at least from the location in Hopkins.

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 15, 2005 11:34 am 
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Location: 35 W and Hiway 10
The Outdoorsman is gone for good. back in the later 80 and thru the nineties it was THE spot in the cities for older winchesters, british guns and tru odd ball stuff. The basement was Grumps home, he was the gun smith, and he had parts All over the place,

typical conversation,
me "what's this?"
him "barrel to a 7x33 sako, based on a long 9mm para case,"
me "i have never heard of that,"
him "It was made for seal hunting, traded a guy a firing pin for an 86 winchester for it"
me "cool. what is that?"
him "brand new in the white model 71 action, it was supposed to get engraved, but now he wants it assembled first. I got parts for one at home...."
you get the idea...he had stuff down there that many museums would have hurt you for.

but the last owner, he knew more than his customers, and that never lasts...

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 15, 2005 5:46 pm 
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My LEAST favorite gun shop is Walt's Pawn & Gun in Monticello. I purchased two long guns there, an AK47 and a Saiga 410. Walt's does have a pretty decent selection, but will charge way above the going price if one is unarmed with accurate info. I stop by to see what he has from time to time and as far as used guns go, he likes to tag them with FULL MSRP or better. The AK I got from him is a piece of junk. It's a SAR1 and keyholes every round. He wasn't willing to correct the problem. I'm looking at replacing the barrel on that one. The Saiga has it's draw backs as it only takes 76mm shells (3"). It doesn't fire slugs worth a damn.

As far as Scheel's in St Cloud, I am less than impressed. I was sent there to look for a stainless DE in 44mag that an acquaintance traded in. Nobody had a clue. They DID have a a USED one in 50AE, with a 10" barrel. I compared it to several on Gunbroker and discovered that the $1500 price tag was about $300-400 over anything NIB on Gunbroker.

Gander Mountain in Waite Park has been very good to me. I've purchased several guns from them and their service has been unparalleled!! Another Good dealer is Dan White with Whitetail Firearms in Monticello. Dan runs his firearms business out of his house. He owns/runs the detailing/car wash almost across the road from Walt's new place on Hwy 25. Dan has fair prices and I've not had anything requiring his attention as far as defective pieces.


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 19, 2005 11:01 pm 
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I actually kinda liked Outdoorsman. You could sit and just hang out, and shoot the breeze all afternoon. A little bit like and old country store. I have thick skin when dealing with strongly opinionated people. Could be from hanging out with gun people all the time. :wink: Sure, he griped about all his woes, but he's right about CZ's, they are one of the best values for the money out there. It didn't help that Gander was sending their customers there to shop, then telling them that whatever price he gave them, they would beat. I would be annoyed, too.

We could talk North Dakota hunting, something we had in common.

Poor guy was dying of cancer the whole time, could be dead by now, for all I know. Could account for some crankiness. Nice wife, too... always offered coffee or a snack.

Too bad no one opened a new shop there, now we are one more less.


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 20, 2005 12:25 pm 
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I would tell Mark to move to the Outdoorsman's location, but from what the outdoorsman owner said, the landlord did not want a gunshop there.

The owner said the landlord was setting off the alarm by rattling the door. It stopped after the chief of police (more or less) 'threatened' the landlord.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 20, 2005 2:11 pm 
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What became of Grump, anyway?


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 27, 2005 9:26 pm 
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Pakrat wrote:
I would tell Mark to move to the Outdoorsman's location, but from what the outdoorsman owner said, the landlord did not want a gunshop there.


Hopkins got less friendly to gun shops when the gang from St. Paul drove a truck through the front wall of Hunter's Den and stole much of the inventory. Gene has since relocated out to St. Boni, and it's worth the drive to me every once in a while.

I shopped in the Outdoorsman in Hopkins twice. One very good experience, and one very bad. Dunno if it was just a bad day or what, but now I won't get a chance to find out.

Least favorite? Bill's in Robbinsdale. I've gone in there ready to buy and ended up leaving and buying elsewhere more often than not. I figure that spending a few dollars more is a bargain when someone will help me make a good decision.


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 28, 2005 1:30 pm 
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I have bought guns at three local stores at one time or another. If I go in knowing what I want, one is pretty much as good as another. If I need some help defining my needs, there are a couple stores I wouldn't go to.

I remember when I bought my first handgun--a revolver. The salesman said that the S&W has a better trigger than a Ruger. I asked him, "At my level of expertise, would I notice the difference?" He said, "No." I really appreciated that.


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