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 Good idea. Attack when you KNOW the children are home 
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 Post subject: Good idea. Attack when you KNOW the children are home
PostPosted: Sun Jan 06, 2008 3:52 pm 
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and kill Mom (who's not a suspect).

Lima, Ohio Drug Raid Gone Bad

Police in Lima, Ohio shot and killed Tarika Wilson, a mother of six, and seriously wounded her one-year-old son during a drug raid yesterday. Police say they were investigating Wilson’s boyfriend for drug distribution. They haven’t yet released why the police fired (though they have said police initially fired at two pit bulls). The fact that they aren’t saying so doesn’t bode well. When the suspect fires first in one of these cases, that fact is generally immediately released to the newspapers.

More disturbing, the police are saying they knew there were children in the home, yet went ahead a highly volatile, forced-entry drug raid, anyway. In fact…

" Police Maj. Richard Shade, a former SWAT commander for the department, said it’s not unusual for children to be inside homes raided by police officers."

And therein lies yet another problem with these raids. It’s bad enough that they’re dangerous for cops, suspects, and people unfortunate enough to be the victim of wrong-door raids. But even when they get the correct house, there’s little regard for the safety of innocent people who might be inside. Why couldn’t they have nabbed this guy as he was coming or going? Why not wait for him to leave, then arrest him in his car? Why put six children and their mother in unnecessary peril?

There are far, far too many cases of innocent children, girlfriends, spouses, relatives, and visitors being at the wrong place at the wrong time, and winding up killed, injured, or arrested for mistaking raiding cops for criminal intruders.

http://www.theagitator.com/2008/01/06/l ... -gone-bad/


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 06, 2008 9:46 pm 
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I have yet to understand the concept behind invading a house full of people when just parking a van in front of the house and then waiting until the guy comes outside to have a smoke or go to the stop and rob for a forty...

Its like going back to Waco and Koresh, a guy who went jogging alone every morning on county roads, but the attempt to arrest had to take place with an armed assault.

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PostPosted: Sun Jan 06, 2008 11:15 pm 
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1911fan wrote:
I have yet to understand the concept behind invading a house full of people when just parking a van in front of the house and then waiting until the guy comes outside to have a smoke or go to the stop and rob for a forty...

Its like going back to Waco and Koresh, a guy who went jogging alone every morning on county roads, but the attempt to arrest had to take place with an armed assault.


It's the Whoopie factor. Remember, for these SWAT guys, a yelling, doorkicking, shooting raid is more exciting that sex with the old lady. They can't face a morning without their adrenalin fix. They are violence junkies. Don't believe me, watch Dallas or Detroit SWAT on TV.

They probably don't consciously want to kill LeRoy but they sure do want to terrify him and smell the shit in his pants. Big men, strong, young men with low self esteem and weak egos. They gotta kick you in order to feel valuable.


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 07, 2008 4:36 am 
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ALL television needs drama. I think the worst is the Predator series that's on all the time.

We see a goofball subject, who when confronted by just a TV commentator, passively sits down and cooperates to a ridiculous degree. Then he walks passively out of the house, stops and waits, only to be attacked by a swarm of screaming cops who make him get on the ground to be handcuffed.

All of these guys could be arrested by simply by politely telling them to stand still for a search, and then jump in the back seat. Which is what veteren officers do when not accompanied by a half dozen pimply-faced wannabe TV cops, dressed up like GI Joe dolls.

If they could just get the men to run a little, like on BadBoys, they could chase them down, the drama would be even better, and the police wouldn't look so silly.

I'd bet some do run away, and those episodes are not shown.


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2008 9:46 am 
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It gets worse. Turns out that the mom was killed and the baby was shot after the doorkickers had the guy in custody.

Sheesh.

At least our local doorkickers missed everybody when they last shot up a house.

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 17, 2008 4:45 pm 
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Activists angry over black woman's death
NAACP in Lima, Ohio, is angry that he faces just two misdemeanors
The Associated Press
updated 4:35 p.m. CT, Mon., March. 17, 2008
LIMA, Ohio - A white police officer accused of fatally shooting a black woman as she held her 1-year-old son during a drug raid was charged with two misdemeanors Monday, outraging activists and relatives of the woman who said he should face tougher penalties.

Sgt. Joseph Chavalia was charged with negligent homicide in the death of Tarika Wilson, 26, who was killed in a January SWAT raid at her house while looking for her boyfriend. He was charged with negligent assault in the wounding of her son Sincere Wilson, whose finger had to be amputated.

Chavalia pleaded not guilty Monday to both counts. If convicted of both he would face a maximum of eight months in jail.

Chavalia was released on a $50,000 bond. His attorney, Bill Kluge, declined to comment after the hearing.

The shooting touched off protests and discussions about race relations. Wilson's family said she was an unarmed, innocent bystander, and her brother and the Lima office of the National Association for the Advancement of Colored People said Monday that the charges should have been more serious.

"Any time a man shoots through a baby and kills an unarmed woman, and is charged with two misdemeanors, I think it would be an understatement to say that that's unacceptable," said Jason Upthegrove, Lima NAACP president. He said the group will ask the FBI and Justice Department to determine whether the case was handled fairly.

"No one's above the law, even if he serves it," said Ivory Austin II, brother of Tarika Wilson. "Don't separate the police from the people. We are all equal in the society. Treat the police like you would treat the common man."

After the arraignment, police Chief Greg Garlock said Chavalia remains suspended with pay and there is continued sadness over Wilson's death.

"It's a sad day for us that one of our officers was indicted," Garlock said.

Little is known about what happened during the raid. Police said Wilson's 31-year-old boyfriend, who was arrested, was the target of a drug investigation. Garlock said marijuana and crack were found.

Many citizens and civil rights leaders, including the Rev. Jesse Jackson, have demanded that Chavalia and Lima police officials who planned the raid be held accountable. About one in four residents of this northwest Ohio city is black.

Copyright 2008 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.
URL: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/23679181/

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 17, 2008 5:28 pm 
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About damn time that the triggerman was indicted; unless there's a lot that we don't know, he clearly should have been. But misdemeanors? Sounds like a rather "isolated incident," doesn't it?

Convicted? We'll see; he's entitled to a defense, after all.

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 07, 2008 10:56 am 
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Today's headline:

Quote:
Officers cheer police shooting verdict in Lima
Posted by Associated Press August 05, 2008

Lima, Ohio -- A jury verdict that cleared a police officer in the drug-raid shooting death of an unarmed woman will allow other officers to do their job without hesitation, police union officials said.

Officers throughout the state closely watched the trial, fearing that a guilty judgment would have changed how they react in the line of fire.

Jurors on Monday acquitted Sgt. Joseph Chavalia on charges of negligent homicide and negligent assault in the death of Tarika Wilson seven months ago. Her year-old son also was injured.

Sgt. Chavalia had testified that he thought his life was in danger when he fired the shots. He said he saw a shadow coming from behind the partially open bedroom door and heard gunshots that he thought were aimed at him.

It turned out that Wilson didn't have a weapon and that the gunfire Chavalia heard was coming from downstairs, where officers shot two charging pit bulls.


LESSON: If you hear shots (that you think are coming from the other side), you can fire through a door at a shadow.


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 07, 2008 12:35 pm 
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kimberman wrote:
Today's headline:

Quote:
Officers cheer police shooting verdict in Lima
Posted by Associated Press August 05, 2008

Lima, Ohio -- A jury verdict that cleared a police officer in the drug-raid shooting death of an unarmed woman will allow other officers to do their job without hesitation, police union officials said.

Officers throughout the state closely watched the trial, fearing that a guilty judgment would have changed how they react in the line of fire.

Jurors on Monday acquitted Sgt. Joseph Chavalia on charges of negligent homicide and negligent assault in the death of Tarika Wilson seven months ago. Her year-old son also was injured.

Sgt. Chavalia had testified that he thought his life was in danger when he fired the shots. He said he saw a shadow coming from behind the partially open bedroom door and heard gunshots that he thought were aimed at him.

It turned out that Wilson didn't have a weapon and that the gunfire Chavalia heard was coming from downstairs, where officers shot two charging pit bulls.


Disgusting.

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 07, 2008 12:58 pm 
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joelr wrote:
kimberman wrote:
Today's headline:

Quote:
Officers cheer police shooting verdict in Lima
Posted by Associated Press August 05, 2008

Lima, Ohio -- A jury verdict that cleared a police officer in the drug-raid shooting death of an unarmed woman will allow other officers to do their job without hesitation, police union officials said.

Officers throughout the state closely watched the trial, fearing that a guilty judgment would have changed how they react in the line of fire.

Jurors on Monday acquitted Sgt. Joseph Chavalia on charges of negligent homicide and negligent assault in the death of Tarika Wilson seven months ago. Her year-old son also was injured.

Sgt. Chavalia had testified that he thought his life was in danger when he fired the shots. He said he saw a shadow coming from behind the partially open bedroom door and heard gunshots that he thought were aimed at him.

It turned out that Wilson didn't have a weapon and that the gunfire Chavalia heard was coming from downstairs, where officers shot two charging pit bulls.


Disgusting.


If I can offer a brief translation to the testimony for those of us not prone to bullshit:

"I was scared shitless when I saw a shadow behind the door, so I messed myself and unloaded my weapon into the door with no clue as to who or what I was shooting. I guess I imagined bullets coming toward me but I never checked to make sure. So having said that, please let me off the hook as I don't see how this is any fault of my own. Further, I have no spine and therefore I have opted to lie through my teeth."

Aren't these guys paid to protect the public in a safe as possible, organized fashion? This idiot should be pulling files in the mail room much less raiding houses. No scratch that, this idiot should be sitting in a 6'x6' room with bars decorating the windows.

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 07, 2008 2:31 pm 
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The whole problem comes from the so called "War on drugs". It's about as effective as prohibition of alcohol was and only creates more criminals and police "armies" that do nothing about the real problem. It does inflate police budgets with our tax dollars.

It seems like the police kill a lot more people than the drugs do. I read an article the other day that said prescription drugs kill far more people every year than all the illegal drugs combined.

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 07, 2008 3:50 pm 
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Ramoel wrote:
The whole problem comes from the so called "War on drugs". It's about as effective as prohibition of alcohol was and only creates more criminals and police "armies" that do nothing about the real problem. It does inflate police budgets with our tax dollars.
Yup. And one of the few rays of hope on this stuff I see these days is how many folks on both the left and the right have figured out that the War on Some Drugs is a criminal employment act.

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 Post subject: THere's more to that story
PostPosted: Thu Aug 07, 2008 5:38 pm 
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http://blog.cleveland.com/metro/2008/08/officers_cheer_police_shooting.html

Now read that URL and note the irony.

Now for the whole story:

Quote:
Officers cheer police shooting verdict in Lima
Posted by Associated Press August 05, 2008 17:42PM
Categories: Crime

Lima, Ohio -- A jury verdict that cleared a police officer in the drug-raid shooting death of an unarmed woman will allow other officers to do their job without hesitation, police union officials said.

Officers throughout the state closely watched the trial, fearing that a guilty judgment would have changed how they react in the line of fire.

Jurors on Monday acquitted Sgt. Joseph Chavalia on charges of negligent homicide and negligent assault in the death of Tarika Wilson seven months ago. Her year-old son also was injured.

Wilson's family filed a lawsuit in federal court Tuesday against Chavalia and the city. Officers had been looking for Wilson's boyfriend, a suspected drug dealer.

Chavalia had testified that he thought his life was in danger when he fired the shots. He said he saw a shadow coming from behind the partially open bedroom door and heard gunshots that he thought were aimed at him.

It turned out that Wilson didn't have a weapon and that the gunfire Chavalia heard was coming from downstairs, where officers shot two charging pit bulls.

Prosecutor Jeffrey Strausbaugh repeatedly pointed out during the trial that Wilson was shot even though she didn't have a gun.

But jurors were told by visiting Judge Richard Knepper during jury instructions that they could not consider the fact that she was unarmed because that was known only after the shooting.

Citing a 1985 U.S. Supreme Court ruling that set guidelines for use of force by police, the jurors were told they could only judge Chavalia's actions based on what he was aware of when he fired into the bedroom where Wilson was with her six children.

It was an important distinction and one that had to be upheld, said Michael Watkins, president of the Fraternal Order of Police in Lima.

"If the rules are changed, officers are going to react later," Watkins said. "You're going to have them hesitating, and there are more who are going to be injured or killed."

During the trial, a Columbus SWAT officer and a retired FBI agent both testified that Chavalia had no choice but to shoot because he thought his life was in danger. They also said Chavalia should have fired sooner.

"Thank God it wasn't me there and every officer feels the same way," said James Scanlon, who has been with the Columbus police since 1978.

Watkins, who joined the Lima department a year before Chavalia in 1976, said he understands why Chavalia shot after hearing the gunfire.

"I knew there had to be more to it," he said. "Joe isn't a trigger happy officer."

The verdict further angered Wilson's family and others in Lima's black community.
"The message I got out of all this is that it's OK for police to go and kill in a drug raid," said Arnold Manley, pastor of Pilgrim Rescue Missionary Baptist Church.

In the lawsuit filed in federal court in Toledo, Wilson's mother said police could have waited until the woman and her children were out of the house to try and arrest Wilson's boyfriend, Anthony Terry, the target of the raid.

The shooting on Jan. 4 led to protests about how police treat minorities in the city where one in four residents is black. Chavalia is white and Wilson was black.

Chavalia's lead attorney, Bill Kluge, said he thinks the only reason the officer was charged was because of the reaction within the community.

"Had this case waited two or three months going to the grand jury, it might have been different," he said.

Chavalia's career with the city's police department is essentially over despite the verdict, Kluge said. He would not say what the officer planned to do next.


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 Post subject: and more...
PostPosted: Thu Aug 07, 2008 5:41 pm 
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http://blog.cleveland.com/metro/2008/08/justice_dept_to_review_lima_po.html

He still faces federal review and a civil lawsuit filed by the dead woman's mother.


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 07, 2008 6:25 pm 
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A jury verdict that cleared a police officer in the drug-raid shooting death of an unarmed woman will allow other officers to do their job without hesitation, police union officials said.

So shooting unarmed women holding babies <I>is</i> part of the job description. Good to have that cleared up.

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