Index  •  FAQ  •  Search  

It is currently Mon Jun 03, 2024 10:04 pm

This is a static archive the Twin Cities Carry forum, maintained as a public service by the current forum of record, The Minnesota Carry Forum.

All times are UTC - 6 hours




Forum locked This topic is locked, you cannot edit posts or make further replies.  [ 29 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2
 The captain is safe! 
Author Message
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Apr 13, 2009 7:15 pm 
Longtime Regular
User avatar

Joined: Thu Oct 13, 2005 12:37 pm
Posts: 1757
Location: Whittier
I think it may be that he was comenting on the bleached state of the Somali Pirate in that computer sim.

_________________
Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a
lawbreaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become
a law unto himself; it invites anarchy .” Olmstead v. U.S., 277 U.S. 438


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Apr 14, 2009 1:11 am 
Longtime Regular
User avatar

Joined: Tue Dec 19, 2006 6:19 am
Posts: 810
Location: Northern MN
Macx wrote:
I think it may be that he was comenting on the bleached state of the Somali Pirate in that computer sim.


BINGO!

If NBC is gonna go to the trouble of making a CG rendition of events, they should try and get it correct.

Actually, come to think of it, I'm surprised that the NBC pirate didn't have a peg leg, a parrot, and a cartoon bubble saying "AARRRR!". :roll:

_________________
Proud, Service Oriented, Rural LEO, or "BADGED COWBOY"
Certified MN Carry Permit Instructor


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Apr 14, 2009 9:06 pm 
Journeyman Member
User avatar

Joined: Thu Nov 13, 2008 1:29 am
Posts: 73
Location: West Twin Cities
Do any of those ships have armed crews?


Thousands of dolphins blocked the suspected Somali pirate ships when they were trying to attack Chinese merchant ships passing the Gulf of Aden
http://news.xinhuanet.com/english/2009- ... 184581.htm
Image


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Apr 14, 2009 9:27 pm 
Longtime Regular
User avatar

Joined: Fri Oct 31, 2008 11:39 pm
Posts: 533
Location: Mankato Area
Communist Dolphins? :lol:

None of the photos shows the dolphins between the pirate boats and the Chinese ships. Sounds more like a jounalistic flight of fancy.


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Apr 14, 2009 9:43 pm 
Forum Moderator
User avatar

Joined: Wed Aug 24, 2005 9:13 pm
Posts: 874
Location: Minneapolis
Need to mount a few of these in a hidden mount...FUN!

http://www.navweaps.com/Weapons/WNUS_4c ... et_pic.jpg

http://www.navweaps.com/Weapons/WNUS_4cm-56_mk12.htm

_________________
Diesel Boats (and Tube Radios) Forever!


Offline
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2009 7:59 am 
Senior Member
User avatar

Joined: Tue Apr 24, 2007 8:25 pm
Posts: 367
Location: Forest Lake, MN
Traveler wrote:
There is much we do not know and much that we will never know about this incident. Let us just thank the Navy Seals for a job well done and not dwell on how they accomplished it. In this case, the ends justify any means whatsoever.


BINGO! It's too bad that the media got a hold of any of this story. I would've preferred that the whole thing went down without any of the public knowing....just take 'em out, save the hostage, and move out. This publicity will without a doubt put the other people being held hostage in (more) danger (How many ships/people are being held by other somali pirates right now?). The media was quoting other pirate "spokesmen" as stating that the US is now their number one enemy, that "we'll be the ones crying", etc. What a bunch of BS.

I do, however, get a warm-fuzzy just thinking about the operation that those SEAL's pulled off. Parachuting into an ocean half-way around the world in the middle of the night, getting into position and pulling off shots like that (plus all of the other details that we will never know). BRAVO! :lol: They are true heroes.

_________________
Pork Chop Sandwiches!


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Apr 25, 2009 9:34 pm 
Longtime Regular
User avatar

Joined: Sun Oct 12, 2008 8:36 am
Posts: 702
Location: St. Paulish
Quote:
How Obama actually delayed pirate rescue
SEAL team deployment stalled 36 hours, hampered by limited rules of engagement
Posted: April 18, 2009 11:45 pm Eastern
story link

WASHINGTON – While Barack Obama is basking in praise for his "decisive" handling of the Somali pirate attack on a merchant ship in the India Ocean, reliable military sources close to the scene are painting a much different picture of the incident – accusing the president of employing restrictive rules of engagement that actually hampered the rescue of Capt. Richard Phillips and extended the drama at sea for days.

Multiple opportunities to free the captain of the Maersk Alabama from three young pirates were missed, these sources say – all because a Navy SEAL team was not immediately ordered to the scene and then forced to operate under strict, non-lethal rules of engagement.

They say the response duty office at the Pentagon was initially unwilling to grant an order to use lethal force to rescue Phillips. They also report the White House refused to authorize deployment of a Navy SEAL team to the location for 36 hours, despite the recommendation of the on-scene commander.

The White House also turned down two rescue plans offered up by the Seal commander on the scene and the captain of the USS Bainbridge.

The SEAL team operated under rules of engagement that required them to do nothing unless the hostage's life was in "imminent' danger.

In fact, when the USS Bainbridge dispatched a rigid-hull inflatable boat to bring supplies to the Maersk Alabama, it came under fire that could not be returned even though the SEAL team had the pirates in their sights.

Many hours before the fatal shots were fired, taking out the three young pirates, Phillips jumped into the Indian Ocean with the idea of giving the snipers a clear target. However, the SEAL team was still under orders not to shoot.

Hours later, frustrated by the missed opportunities to resolve the standoff, the commander of the Bainbridge and the captain of the Navy SEAL team determined they had operational authority to evaluate the risk to the hostage, and took out the pirates at the first opportunity – finally freeing Phillips.

_________________
Proud owner of 2 wonderful SGH holsters.
"If man will not work, he shall not eat" (2 Th 3:14)
"If you don't have a sword, sell your cloak and buy one" -Jesus (Luke 22:36)


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Apr 25, 2009 9:49 pm 
Longtime Regular
User avatar

Joined: Wed Sep 21, 2005 8:28 pm
Posts: 2362
Location: Uptown Minneapolis
PocketProtector642 wrote:
Quote:
How Obama actually delayed pirate rescue
SEAL team deployment stalled 36 hours, hampered by limited rules of engagement
Posted: April 18, 2009 11:45 pm Eastern
story link

WASHINGTON – While Barack Obama is basking in praise for his "decisive" handling of the Somali pirate attack on a merchant ship in the India Ocean, reliable military sources close to the scene are painting a much different picture of the incident – accusing the president of employing restrictive rules of engagement that actually hampered the rescue of Capt. Richard Phillips and extended the drama at sea for days.

Multiple opportunities to free the captain of the Maersk Alabama from three young pirates were missed, these sources say – all because a Navy SEAL team was not immediately ordered to the scene and then forced to operate under strict, non-lethal rules of engagement.

They say the response duty office at the Pentagon was initially unwilling to grant an order to use lethal force to rescue Phillips. They also report the White House refused to authorize deployment of a Navy SEAL team to the location for 36 hours, despite the recommendation of the on-scene commander.

The White House also turned down two rescue plans offered up by the Seal commander on the scene and the captain of the USS Bainbridge.

The SEAL team operated under rules of engagement that required them to do nothing unless the hostage's life was in "imminent' danger.

In fact, when the USS Bainbridge dispatched a rigid-hull inflatable boat to bring supplies to the Maersk Alabama, it came under fire that could not be returned even though the SEAL team had the pirates in their sights.

Many hours before the fatal shots were fired, taking out the three young pirates, Phillips jumped into the Indian Ocean with the idea of giving the snipers a clear target. However, the SEAL team was still under orders not to shoot.

Hours later, frustrated by the missed opportunities to resolve the standoff, the commander of the Bainbridge and the captain of the Navy SEAL team determined they had operational authority to evaluate the risk to the hostage, and took out the pirates at the first opportunity – finally freeing Phillips.


Not sure I buy that.

_________________
"The right of citizens to bear arms is just one more guarantee against arbitrary government, one more safeguard against the tyranny which now appears remote in America, but which historically has proved to be always possible." - Vice President Hubert H. Humphrey, 1960

"Man has the right to deal with his oppressors by devouring their palpitating hearts." - Jean-Paul Marat


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Apr 25, 2009 11:42 pm 
Longtime Regular

Joined: Sun Aug 28, 2005 2:54 am
Posts: 2444
Location: West Central MN
Sounds like just another way to bitch about Obama.


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Apr 26, 2009 9:31 am 
Longtime Regular
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jan 15, 2008 9:40 pm
Posts: 2264
Location: Eden Prairie
That account got debunked by the military a few days ago.


Offline
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Apr 26, 2009 10:28 am 
Longtime Regular
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jan 02, 2008 12:53 am
Posts: 725
Location: New Ulm area
I checked several stories and they all gave the email from somebody's SEAL pals in Virginia Beach as their source of infomation. That email has been discredited on Snopes. The Snopes story is an interesting read.

http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/pirates.asp

There is also a story in The Washington Times if you want something that may be closer to the truth than internet rumors.

http://washingtontimes.com/news/2009...s-for-pirates/

Problem is.......There are still some important issues in all of this that are not in any doubt.

Obama sent in FBI negotiators to try to have this end without the use of violence.

He only would authorize the use of deadly force if the on scene commander determined that Phillips' life was in immediate peril.

While Obama may not have actually said the ROE was this or that, his desire to attempt negotiations and his order of when to use deadly force pretty much accomplished the same thing. He is the Commander in Chief of all US armed forces and as so every person in the military is bound to obey every lawful order he gives.

Bottom line...a bunch of rag tag dirtbags in a row boat holds off the United States Navy in the ocean for how many days??????

Give me a break, what will happen when a real threat happens??

Yeah......the guy who while in office (as an IL Senator), voted 130 some times as "present!"

He can't even decide yes or no!!!! :evil:

_________________
The only downfall to a 1911A1, is actually a plus: You can have it your way, and can put an unreal amount of money into em'.

Squeeze trigger, BANG, repeat. Kind of boring, but I never cared for drama.


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Apr 26, 2009 10:58 am 
Longtime Regular

Joined: Sun Aug 28, 2005 2:54 am
Posts: 2444
Location: West Central MN
If Obama actually behaved as you said, then, he did exactly the right thing.


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Apr 26, 2009 1:21 pm 
Longtime Regular
User avatar

Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2006 9:54 am
Posts: 5270
Location: Minneapolis
Funny how even though we got the right result, everyone is bitching.

This pirate "crisis" is a great little distraction. Sort of like this new Swine Flu "emergency".

_________________
I am defending myself... in favor of that!


Offline
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Apr 26, 2009 10:39 pm 
Senior Member
User avatar

Joined: Thu Jul 12, 2007 1:00 pm
Posts: 373
Traveler wrote:
There is much we do not know and much that we will never know about this incident. Let us just thank the Navy Seals for a job well done and not dwell on how they accomplished it. In this case, the ends justify any means whatsoever.


FYI:

<p><img align="left" alt="maersk-life-boat.jpg" src="http://www.defensetech.org/images/maersk-life-boat.jpg" width="300" height="258" hspace="10" vspace="5"/></p>

<p>We've got some details trickling in about the specifics of the SEAL sniper shots on the pirates holding the Maersk-Alabama's captain, Richard Phillips.</p>

<p><a href="http://combatoperator.com/blog" target="_blank">The Combat Operator's</a> Jake Allen -- not a former SEAL, but a Marine infantry officer and private military contractor and security consultant with sourcing in the Teams -- had no detailed information on the actual shot, but described the overall techniques used by the SEAL team.</p>

<p>First of all, multiple sources indicate this was conducted by SEAL Team VI, aka Naval Special Warfare Development Group, aka "DevGru." This is the naval equivalent of Delta Force.<br />
Allen says the team likely were on the intel of the incident very soon after news hit the wires about the capture and were already well in advance of developing a plan to rescue Phillips before they deployed to the USS Bainbridge.</p>

<p>It's unclear why the team decided to parachute onto the scene under cover of darkness from a C-17 with rafts. One possibility is that this was a far more covert entry than simply landing on the destroyer via helicopter, or Allen says it could have been due to range restrictions...did the DevGru guys travel straight from Little Creek, Va.? Probably.</p>

<p>There was no rest and relaxation or getting rid of the jetlag for the team, Allen estimates, they were planning and rehersing shortly after arriving aboard the Bainbridge. Delay is, however, in their favor, Allen said, since food was running out, sleep was short and the weather was worsening for the ill-trained pirates who probably were beginning to realize they bit off more than they could chew.</p>

<p>Whether it was luck or planning, clearly the idea to tow the life boat behind the Bainbridge and reel it into closer range made a sniper takedown much more of a reasonable possibility than any other tactic, sources say. A shot of 80-90 feet -- even at night and in rolling seas -- is a cakewalk for DevGru SEALs.</p>

<p>"These guys can put three rounds onto the head of a quarter at that range," Allen told me.</p>

<p>And let's not get carried away with the sea state, says DT contributor <a href="http://www.joebuff.com" target="_blank">Joe Buff</a>. A multi-thousand ton destroyer is a pretty stable platform in any but the most tumultuous sea states and makes dialing in a shot on an admittedly tossing life raft more doable -- a smart platform for the Team to operate from.</p>

<p>We also have some information -- unconfirmed, though we're working on it -- about how the shots were taken and what was used. Our firearms expert Eric Poole who writes for <a href="http://www.tactical-life.com" target="_blank">Tactical-Life</a> posits that the snipers were using the <a href="http://www.knightarmco.com/images/sr25.html" target="_blank">MK-11 .308 sniper system</a> manufactured by Knights Armament Co. This weapons is awesome, by the way (I've shot it a few times myself) and, if this is indeed what the shooters used, would mark a major, high-profile departure from legacy thinking about sniping which holds bolt-action rifles as the Gold Standard or marksmanship.</p>

<p>Poole figures the DevGru frogmen removed the "overpowered" standard-issue Leupold scopes and opted for the <a href="http://www.aimpoint.com/products/aimpoint_product_lines/aimpoint_compm2" target="_blank">Aimpoint CCO</a> augmented by the PVS-14 night vision monocular. Though the SEAL version of the MK-11 Mod 0 is issued with supressors, it's unclear whether the operators used them, but I'd bet a million bucks they did.</p>

<p>One other question (among many) remains open...were there three shots or four? Poole reasons, and Allen and I agree, that someone had to shoot through the lifeboat window first, then fire the kill shots. My limited knowledge of ballistics leads me to believe the snipers could not rely on the effectiveness of the one window shot to actually strike the target where it was aimed based in the potential deflection of hitting that probably plastic (glass) window.</p>

<p>Poole, Allen and Buff agree that this operation was meticulously planned and flawlessly executed. The DevGru SEALs developed the situation (with their interagency partners in the FBI and other OGAs), planned an attack and executed when the opportunity presented itself (and I don't buy this "the captain was in danger" line the Pentagon and White House is trying to sell here...you mean to tell me Phillips hadn't had a gun pointed at his back anytime before this?)...It was a kick butt operation carried out by one of the best counterterrorist units in the world and they deserve a huge HooYah from all of us...</p>

<p>-- Christian</p>

_________________

In a big country dreams stay with you, like a lover's voice fires the mountainside. Stay alive.


Offline
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Forum locked This topic is locked, you cannot edit posts or make further replies.  [ 29 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2

This is a static archive the Twin Cities Carry forum, maintained as a public service by the current forum of record, The Minnesota Carry Forum.

All times are UTC - 6 hours


 Who is online 

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 17 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  


 
Index  |  FAQ  |  Search

phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group