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PocketProtector642
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Post subject: Today's Top Stories Posted: Wed Apr 01, 2009 5:42 pm |
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Longtime Regular |
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Joined: Sun Oct 12, 2008 8:36 am Posts: 702 Location: St. Paulish
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While world leaders are battling over new world currencies, financial architecture, and more stimulus packages at the G20 Summit on the Global Economy, protesters are comming out in full force against the growth of against unchecked capitalism, war, and destruction of the environment.
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In other news, Obama's iPod gift includes 40 Broadway show tunes!
_________________ Proud owner of 2 wonderful SGH holsters. "If man will not work, he shall not eat" (2 Th 3:14) "If you don't have a sword, sell your cloak and buy one" -Jesus (Luke 22:36)
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Lenny7
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Post subject: Re: Today's Top Stories Posted: Thu Apr 02, 2009 12:53 am |
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Joined: Tue Mar 14, 2006 11:09 am Posts: 1060 Location: Savage, MN
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PocketProtector642 wrote: protesters are comming out in full force against the growth of against unchecked capitalism, war, and destruction of the environment.
Where is capitalism growing unchecked? It sure isn't in the USA. Quite the opposite.
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Pat Cannon
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Post subject: Re: Today's Top Stories Posted: Thu Apr 02, 2009 8:19 am |
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Joined: Mon Aug 08, 2005 10:53 pm Posts: 1421 Location: South Minneapolis (East of Lake Nokomis)
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Lenny7 wrote: Where is capitalism growing unchecked? It sure isn't in the USA. Quite the opposite.
Exactly -- the fat cats have managed to cloak the current corrupt corporate-welfare regime in the guise of capitalism, so that any criticism of it is automatically "communist".
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Jeremiah
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Post subject: Re: Today's Top Stories Posted: Thu Apr 02, 2009 9:02 am |
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Raving Moderate |
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Joined: Thu Mar 23, 2006 12:46 pm Posts: 1292 Location: Minneapolis
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Pat Cannon wrote: Lenny7 wrote: Where is capitalism growing unchecked? It sure isn't in the USA. Quite the opposite. Exactly -- the fat cats have managed to cloak the current corrupt corporate-welfare regime in the guise of capitalism, so that any criticism of it is automatically "communist".
+1
_________________ I'm liberal, pro-choice, and I carry a gun. Any questions?
My real name is Jeremiah (go figure).
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wheatstraw
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Post subject: Posted: Thu Apr 02, 2009 11:48 pm |
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Joined: Sun Jan 11, 2009 3:02 pm Posts: 22
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I can't speak directly for the G20 protesters but historically the message of the J18/seattle WTO/G8/etc protesters has been that of anti-globalization. Mainly, that the developed countries (particularly the US) continue to exploit developing nations by establishing multi-national corporations operating where economic conditions, labor laws, and environmental standards are weak.
With this definition of "unchecked capitalism", yes, capitalism does continue to grow unchecked here in the US. With our own economy in the tank, you can bet companies will be looking for any way shave costs, and the poorer nations _will_ be exploited.
Another example of unchecked capitalism was the relaxation of lending standards and questionable banking practices (sub-prime loans, mortgage backed securities, derivatives) that lead to the current banking crisis. The bailout, or "socialization of America", or whatever you want to call it, is simply a response to that unchecked capitalism. Now don't get me wrong, I despise the wall-street bailout. The lack of provisions attached to the wall-street bailout was sickening. However, let's not forget that there was an electronic run on the banks that nearly destroyed our economy. Something needed to be done quickly so congress drafted a bill and Bush signed it.
Any talk of Quote: the current corrupt corporate-welfare regime (presumably meaning Obama and the Dem congress) is an unfair characterization. I truly believe that the situation would have played out the same regardless of what party was in control of the legislative and executive branches.
In the case of the banking crisis, the "free market" failed. Both Reps and Dems allowed this to happen. Anyone who believes that the "socialization of america" is purely a result of Obama's administration needs to turn off the conservative talk radio for a brief moment every day and start thinking for themselves.
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Lenny7
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Post subject: Posted: Fri Apr 03, 2009 12:26 am |
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Joined: Tue Mar 14, 2006 11:09 am Posts: 1060 Location: Savage, MN
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wheatstraw wrote: Mainly, that the developed countries (particularly the US) continue to exploit developing nations by establishing multi-national corporations operating where economic conditions, labor laws, and environmental standards are weak.
Yeah, it's just terrible when these multi nationals come into a poor country, build factories, and provide jobs for the locals.
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princewally
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Post subject: Posted: Fri Apr 03, 2009 7:36 am |
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Joined: Wed Jan 24, 2007 11:02 am Posts: 1684 Location: St Louis Park
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wheatstraw wrote: Another example of unchecked capitalism was the relaxation of lending standards and questionable banking practices (sub-prime loans, mortgage backed securities, derivatives) that lead to the current banking crisis. The bailout, or "socialization of America", or whatever you want to call it, is simply a response to that unchecked capitalism.
By "unchecked capitalism" you mean when the government comes in and says "give loans to the poor segment of your territory so they can get houses or we'll pull your license", right?
That's like the definition of deregulation: "We're removing 1% of the regulations, to give us better control, so ignore the 30% increase in new regulations so we can call it 'deregulation'.
The last hundred years have been almost constant additions to regulation and 'checks' on capitalism. Blaming the current situation on circumstances we haven't seen in almost a century is silly.
_________________ Of the people, By the People, For the People. The government exists to serve us, not the reverse.
-------------------- Next MN carry permit class: TBD.
Permit to Carry MN --------------------
jason <at> metrodefense <dot> com
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mrokern
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Post subject: Posted: Fri Apr 03, 2009 9:12 am |
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Joined: Tue Jan 15, 2008 9:40 pm Posts: 2264 Location: Eden Prairie
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Lenny7 wrote: wheatstraw wrote: Mainly, that the developed countries (particularly the US) continue to exploit developing nations by establishing multi-national corporations operating where economic conditions, labor laws, and environmental standards are weak. Yeah, it's just terrible when these multi nationals come into a poor country, build factories, and provide jobs for the locals.
If they are building sweatshops? Yeah, it is. Not because they are breaking laws (they usually aren't), but because it's not fucking ethical or moral.
Same reason I try not to go to Walmart if at all possible. Saving 25 cents isn't worth it to me to support a company that treats workers like shit. And no, it's got nothing to do with unions...I'm no friend of unions myself...it's about doing right by other people.
You can't avoid all of it...there are things that Target just doesn't carry, but just as I try not to support anti-gun businesses more than necessary, I try not to support unethical businesses either.
-Mark
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Carbide Insert
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Post subject: Posted: Fri Apr 03, 2009 10:19 am |
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Poet Laureate |
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Joined: Sat Aug 19, 2006 11:36 am Posts: 760 Location: Hutchinson, MN
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wheatstraw wrote: Anyone who believes that the "socialization of america" is purely a result of Obama's administration needs to turn off the conservative talk radio for a brief moment every day and start thinking for themselves.
+1
In fact, it's not even just about thinking. There are mounds of evidence incriminating the one party system. You just need to open your eyes and break the matrix of R = Good and D = Bad (or vice versa as your personal case may be).
The collectivists are pulling the county out from under us!!
_________________ It's not always easy these days to tell which of our two major political parties is the Stupid Party and which is the Evil Party...
But it remains true that from time to time they collaborate on something that's both stupid and evil and call it bipartisanship. -Thomas E. Woods Jr.
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mrokern
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Post subject: Posted: Fri Apr 03, 2009 10:30 am |
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Joined: Tue Jan 15, 2008 9:40 pm Posts: 2264 Location: Eden Prairie
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Carbide Insert wrote: wheatstraw wrote: Anyone who believes that the "socialization of america" is purely a result of Obama's administration needs to turn off the conservative talk radio for a brief moment every day and start thinking for themselves. +1In fact, it's not even just about thinking. There are mounds of evidence incriminating the one party system. You just need to open your eyes and break the matrix of R = Good and D = Bad (or vice versa as your personal case may be). The collectivists are pulling the county out from under us!!
And a +1 as well!
This country was never meant to be run by any one party. Our system of government is based on people of different views debating and voting, not having a single block of professional politicians ram their personal financial agendas (and ALL their agendas are financial, if you dig down far enough) down our throats.
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jenga
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Post subject: Posted: Fri Apr 03, 2009 10:50 am |
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Joined: Sun Feb 03, 2008 1:12 pm Posts: 21
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It seems when both parties where in gridlock, one side could not ram through their agenda and both sides had to appeal to the middle ground to get anything done. Ahhh the good old days.
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Scott Hughes
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Post subject: Posted: Fri Apr 03, 2009 11:17 am |
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Joined: Wed Oct 04, 2006 10:44 pm Posts: 1525 Location: Isanti, MN
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mrokern wrote: Same reason I try not to go to Walmart if at all possible. Saving 25 cents isn't worth it to me to support a company that treats workers like shit. And no, it's got nothing to do with unions...I'm no friend of unions myself...it's about doing right by other people. -Mark
Respectfully Mark I find some disagreement with this analogy. The workers at Walmart are not compelled to work there. I know people that work there or have worked there and don't have a lot of complaints. However if someone were to feel that they were treated unfairly by their employeer that individual should look for other work. If as an employer I found that I could not hire or retain employees I would need to determine the cause for those circumstances.
_________________ “Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery.”
- Winston Churchill -
WITHOUT LIBERTY THERE IS NO FREEDOM
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Dee
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Post subject: Posted: Sat Apr 04, 2009 10:01 pm |
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Joined: Fri Oct 31, 2008 11:39 pm Posts: 533 Location: Mankato Area
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Scott Hughes wrote: mrokern wrote: Same reason I try not to go to Walmart if at all possible. Saving 25 cents isn't worth it to me to support a company that treats workers like shit. And no, it's got nothing to do with unions...I'm no friend of unions myself...it's about doing right by other people. -Mark Respectfully Mark I find some disagreement with this analogy. The workers at Walmart are not compelled to work there. I know people that work there or have worked there and don't have a lot of complaints. However if someone were to feel that they were treated unfairly by their employeer that individual should look for other work. If as an employer I found that I could not hire or retain employees I would need to determine the cause for those circumstances.
+1
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