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Alamogordo police pay $21,000 to settle open carry lawsuit
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Hunter07
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Post subject: Alamogordo police pay $21,000 to settle open carry lawsuit Posted: Thu Oct 01, 2009 3:12 am |
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Longtime Regular |
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Joined: Wed Jan 02, 2008 12:53 am Posts: 725 Location: New Ulm area
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http://www.examiner.com/x-2782-DC-Gu...-carry-lawsuitAlamogordo police pay $21,000 to settle open carry lawsuit September 29, 8:37 PMDC Gun Rights ExaminerMike Stollenwerk As reported in the Alamogordo Daily News today, the Alamogordo, NM Police have paid $21,000 to settle with Matthew A. St. John whom police detained for open carrying a holstered handgun at a movie theater. This settlement follows a host of settlements by police departments around the country with plaintiffs who were detained by police for openly carrying a holstered handgun, including Pennsylvania, Louisiana, Virginia (see another settlement here), and Georgia. More cases are still pending in Ohio, Georgia, Wisconsin, Michigan, and Pennsylvania. On September 8, 2009, Federal District Judge Bruce D. Black, issued an order previously examined here, that concluded as a matter of law that Alamogordo police officiers violated Matthew St. John's constitutional rights under the Fourth Amendment because they seized and disarmed him even though there was not "any reason to believe that a crime was afoot." Judge Black's opinion is consistent with numerous high state and federal appellate court rulings, including the United States Supreme Court, holding that there is no firearms exception to the Fourth Amendment. Judge Black has designated his September 8, 2009 opinion and order to be "published" in the official reporter for the United States Federal District Court for New Mexico. While unpublished opinions can be cited in the future by litigants and other courts, a "published" opinion is viewed as having more weight as a source of law than "unpublished" opinions. The case can now be cited as St. John v. McColley, et al., --- F.Supp.2d ----, 2009 WL 2949302 (D.N.M. 2009). Alamogordo Department of Public Safety Director Sam Trujillo (and president of the New Mexico Association of Chiefs of Police) told the Examiner.com today that his Department will be "examining that case with in-house counsel" with an eye toward refining police procedures and training to ensure that police officer contacts with open carriers do not offend the Fourth Amendment's protection against unreasonable search and seizure. Mr. Trujillo also said his Department will attempt to identify what circumstances, if any, under the law of trespass in New Mexico, police officers may act on behalf of private property owners to ask people carrying guns to leave private property, or if the private owner or his agent must provide this notice. The open carry of holstered handguns is legal in 42 states, and requires no license in New Mexico and twenty-five other states.
_________________ The only downfall to a 1911A1, is actually a plus: You can have it your way, and can put an unreal amount of money into em'.
Squeeze trigger, BANG, repeat. Kind of boring, but I never cared for drama.
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chunkstyle
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Post subject: Re: Alamogordo police pay $21,000 to settle open carry lawsuit Posted: Thu Oct 01, 2009 7:25 am |
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Longtime Regular |
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Joined: Wed Sep 21, 2005 8:28 pm Posts: 2362 Location: Uptown Minneapolis
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Wow! There still is a 4th Amendment?
_________________ "The right of citizens to bear arms is just one more guarantee against arbitrary government, one more safeguard against the tyranny which now appears remote in America, but which historically has proved to be always possible." - Vice President Hubert H. Humphrey, 1960
"Man has the right to deal with his oppressors by devouring their palpitating hearts." - Jean-Paul Marat
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Selurcspi
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Post subject: Re: Alamogordo police pay $21,000 to settle open carry lawsuit Posted: Thu Oct 01, 2009 10:34 am |
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Longtime Regular |
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Joined: Fri Feb 24, 2006 1:02 pm Posts: 1569 Location: The Mild, Mild, West, Burbs
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This should read:
Alamogordo Tax Payers pay $21,000 to settle open carry lawsuit
_________________ NRA Certified Instructor MADFI Certified Instructor MN DNR Certified Instructor UT BCI Certified Conceal/Carry Instructor
"If you expect the police to always be able to protect you, why are the ones who show up at crimes called 'detectives' instead of 'defenders'? Detectives try to find a criminal after they've committed a crime."
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DeanC
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Post subject: Re: Alamogordo police pay $21,000 to settle open carry lawsuit Posted: Thu Oct 01, 2009 11:01 am |
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Longtime Regular |
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Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2006 9:54 am Posts: 5270 Location: Minneapolis
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_________________ I am defending myself... in favor of that!
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kimberman
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Post subject: Re: Alamogordo police pay $21,000 to settle open carry lawsuit Posted: Thu Oct 01, 2009 7:20 pm |
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Wise Elder |
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Joined: Thu Aug 11, 2005 7:48 pm Posts: 2782 Location: St. Paul
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Police May Not Even Temporarily Detain a Person Simply Because He’s Openly Carrying a Handgun, if such open carrying in that place is generally not a crime. This is not directly applicable to Minnesota but it is a well reasoned. It should be applicable from the moment on once you display your carry permit. The New Mexico federal district court opinion is discussed at http://volokh.com/2009/10/01/police-may ... -a-handgun. The opinion is available at http://ia311029.us.archive.org/1/items/ ... 7.48.0.pdf.
_________________ President of AACFI, GOCRA, CCRN, and A2A
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kecker
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Post subject: Re: Alamogordo police pay $21,000 to settle open carry lawsuit Posted: Thu Oct 01, 2009 8:45 pm |
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Joined: Tue Jul 15, 2008 9:57 am Posts: 818 Location: Apple Valley, MN
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So assuming you haven't done anything, basically once you display your permit, and presumably they call in and verify it, you (and your firearm) is basically untouchable? Am I reading that correctly?
_________________ http://www.eckernet.com My mind is like a steel trap - rusty and illegal in 37 states.
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chunkstyle
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Post subject: Re: Alamogordo police pay $21,000 to settle open carry lawsuit Posted: Thu Oct 01, 2009 8:58 pm |
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Joined: Wed Sep 21, 2005 8:28 pm Posts: 2362 Location: Uptown Minneapolis
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Of course, they can always make something else up to detain you for.
_________________ "The right of citizens to bear arms is just one more guarantee against arbitrary government, one more safeguard against the tyranny which now appears remote in America, but which historically has proved to be always possible." - Vice President Hubert H. Humphrey, 1960
"Man has the right to deal with his oppressors by devouring their palpitating hearts." - Jean-Paul Marat
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Q_Continuum
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Post subject: Re: Alamogordo police pay $21,000 to settle open carry lawsuit Posted: Fri Oct 02, 2009 1:34 am |
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Joined: Sun Oct 19, 2008 2:43 am Posts: 371 Location: Anoka, MN
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kecker wrote: So assuming you haven't done anything, basically once you display your permit, and presumably they call in and verify it, you (and your firearm) is basically untouchable? Am I reading that correctly? Unless you're doing something that's not allowed, yes - they can verify your permit is valid, but so long as you're not violating any law (they may ask you to leave on behalf of the shopkeeper, and if you refuse - THEN you're trespassing, etc) there's nothing else they can do. (Without finding "some other reason" to take you into custody)
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singhcr
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Post subject: Re: Alamogordo police pay $21,000 to settle open carry lawsuit Posted: Fri Oct 02, 2009 12:26 pm |
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Journeyman Member |
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Joined: Sun Jul 27, 2008 2:36 pm Posts: 67 Location: Apple Valley, MN
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During traffic stops, with this new ruling (assuming it is applied to other states) can police seize your firearm at all? Or do they basically have the right to seize your firearm if they see or know about it, and then give it back to you once you show your permit?
4th Amendment rights extend to traffic stops but the bar for "reasonable cause" seems pretty low.
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farmerj
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Post subject: Re: Alamogordo police pay $21,000 to settle open carry lawsuit Posted: Fri Oct 02, 2009 5:21 pm |
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Joined: Tue Aug 22, 2006 12:13 am Posts: 714 Location: A County in MN
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chunkstyle wrote: Of course, they can always make something else up to detain you for. It's called disorderly conduct...
_________________ We reap what we sow. In our case, we have sown our government.
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[ 10 posts ] |
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